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This podcast examines the oddities of the world...Cryptids to Conspiracies, Cults to Curiosities, Myths to Mysteries, and so much more! Stop by the shop, where the bizarre is always on sale... Each week your curators, Kara Perakovic and Zach Palmer will be opening the shop and sharing stories with you.
Oddity Shop
The Kennedy's Dark Legacy: Conspiracies, Karma, and Curses
Welcome To The Oddity Shop, Where The Bizarre is Always on Sale. This week, your Curator Kara is telling us all about the Dark Side of The Kennedy Family.
The story of John F. Kennedy isn't just presidential history—it's a Shakespearean tragedy filled with shocking secrets and devastating consequences. Our deep dive uncovers the dark reality behind America's "Camelot" myth and the price paid for political ambition.
From the Bay of Pigs fiasco to the Cuban Missile Crisis, from civil rights reluctance to Vietnam escalation, Kennedy made powerful enemies across Washington's corridors of power. His assassination spawned America's most enduring conspiracy theories, with classified documents still withheld decades later. Even more chilling is the pattern of deaths, tragedies and "accidents" that have followed the Kennedy family across generations, suggesting something beyond mere coincidence.
What was the true cost of America's Camelot? Listen and decide for yourself if the Kennedy legacy represents ambition's ultimate reward—or its punishment.
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I want to dance with the monk men At the IA shop, bathed in the moonlight At the IA shop. Creep through the graveyard To the IA shop. The door's always open At the IA Shop. The door's always open at the RA Shop. What's up, oddballs? Welcome back to another episode of the Oddity Shop podcast, the place where we tell you creepy, odd, weird, strange, spooky stories from around the globe. Kara, how the heck are you doing? Oh, sorry, this is your curator, kara. I have to use your proper noun. I am the curator, zach. Okay, now how are you doing?
Speaker 2:I'm doing good, jesus, I'm so chaotic already.
Speaker 1:No, not Jesus Curator Zach.
Speaker 2:I am doing great.
Speaker 1:Wonderful.
Speaker 2:We were just talking about mukbangs off air and no that made me not great, but other than that, I just I can't, I don't understand it.
Speaker 1:No, I don't want to eat on camera. I don't want to watch anybody else eat on camera.
Speaker 2:Quite. Frankly, I don't even want to like go out to eat with people. Do you know what I mean?
Speaker 1:No, that doesn't bother me.
Speaker 2:It doesn't bother me per se, unless I think about it.
Speaker 1:Weird. No, it doesn't like, I guess, when I'm with people but watching like a recording of other people, because it's all you can focus on.
Speaker 2:Well, that too. And also like, if you're going, typically I would hope that you're going out to eat with people that you like, like, so they don't like make you feel that way, but still, fair, fair enough.
Speaker 1:Hey, it's been a minute since a fair enough. Okay, what's new with you other than being discussed about mukbangs?
Speaker 2:uh, what is new? Um, yeah, I don't know. I feel like summer is going by like fast but slow, but then also I'm like, holy shit, june's almost over and it's been. Where's the summer really been? We've had some hot days, but now it's been raining.
Speaker 1:I had that moment yesterday where I realized we're already more than halfway through 2025 and I don't get it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I thought about that the other day and I was like this happens every year, like I think, oh God, how are we going to start the podcast like this? I feel like time is going faster than it ever did, and I mean that I don't feel like it's just like what people say, like it goes by so fast, if you blink you'll miss it. No, I think so. Well, our world's fucked up. We know that, but something's not right.
Speaker 1:With the timeline.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Okay, I need you and every other listener to put a giant pin in that. Okay, because I have almost an entire episode worth of a response for you on that. I think this is the first time you have guessed my episode on your episode, so nicely done.
Speaker 2:That's awesome. Okay, well, what's new with you?
Speaker 1:Okay. So, speaking of summer, I had honestly the perfect summer day today. Okay, what'd you do? I worked my butt off yesterday and I had a random weekday off today, which I don't usually have, nope. So I got up and I did like some chores around the house not a whole lot, but just like the things I needed to do and then I was chilling for a little bit. So I decided I was going to take myself out for lunch.
Speaker 2:Well, first off, you were blowing me up at 8am, sendingm, sending me tiktok after tiktok, after tiktok I was like trying to get ready because I didn't have to get out of bed. I could actually go through that I forgot you the day off and I was like what the hell is zachary?
Speaker 1:so, uh, yeah, no, I blew you up with tiktoks. I did some chores. I took myself out to lunch to this dive bar I used to always go to and one of my favorite, favorite bartenders of all time had switched from nights to days, so I haven't seen her forever and she happened to be working and it was her birthday oh, that's fun I got to hang out with her and then I went and bought myself a new pipe and took that to the uh woods.
Speaker 1:I went to a little hiking trail, took my hammock, the new pipe and my switch and I played some stardew valley and meditated and stuff, just hanging out in the woods for a few hours that's cute.
Speaker 2:And then I okay, I was.
Speaker 1:I came back and I convinced julia to get ice cream and I got you a gift along the way oh wow, I almost got your gift yesterday uh, don't talk about, don't. I want to show you the gift, don't, don't derail me. I thought you were gonna show me it's a little enamel pin that has a UFO beaming up a cup of coffee and it says we need coffee.
Speaker 1:Oh my God, that's really cute, that's adorable, the cutest and I figure because you and I have not been getting enough sleep on our adventures lately. It was perfect.
Speaker 2:That is perfect. Speaking of I don't remember oh, shopping and shit. Your favorite store is like everything's 50% off, so you might want to go buy shorts and stuff. Your favorite store is like everything's 50% off, so you might want to go buy shorts and stuff.
Speaker 1:Oh, old Navy, yeah yeah, they do that like once a week. It's fine.
Speaker 2:Well, no, it's like a major, like clearance sale.
Speaker 1:Don't tell me that I was just thinking today. I haven't bought that many new clothes this year, but I basically redid my entire wardrobe last year, so I don't need to.
Speaker 2:OK, whatever, here's your question.
Speaker 1:Perfect, yeah, we need to get the shop open.
Speaker 2:Nature versus nurture.
Speaker 1:You've asked me this question before. It's both baby.
Speaker 2:But is it like, do you really think? But is it both, as in it's always both, or do you think that you just believe in both, like this? This instance could be this and this instance could be that.
Speaker 1:Do you want my nerdy answer?
Speaker 2:Sure.
Speaker 1:Okay, cause this is like I went to school for social psychology. I know different personality traits are weighted differently on how much they're affected by nature and nurture. So it depends on what we're talking about specifically and the weighting of it and how much your genetics play in and how much the way you were raised plays into it. So I always think, yes, it is 100 both me too.
Speaker 2:Okay, so I am going to preface this. That's just your question. Goodbye, bye. So this episode is a lot of facts, so I do repeat myself, like repeat the facts in different like categories, I guess you could say, just because it's hard to keep up and I just want everyone to remember.
Speaker 1:Brace yourselves. Kara's repeating herself, and she never does that. No, I'm kidding.
Speaker 2:No, I mean like I'm like there might be like full facts that you're like we already heard that, but it's just because I don't want you guys to get mixed up along the way and I want you to kind of remember everything. And I tried to categorize it, to be organized and not, but it's you know.
Speaker 1:I'll let you go.
Speaker 2:Okay, are you ready?
Speaker 1:I am ready, okay.
Speaker 2:Today, I bring you the epic and tragic saga of John F Kennedy. Yes, so there's a lot.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh, how have we not done this yet?
Speaker 2:It's been on my list, baby Okay.
Speaker 1:Okay, Drama-less baby. Uh okay, Ooh, okay.
Speaker 2:So, more than a president, he was a symbol, but beneath the charm was a web of secrets, sickness, sex and suspicion. This is the rise and fall of JFK and the curse that may have haunted his bloodline forever.
Speaker 1:I have a lifelong obsession with the Kennedys. I am so ready for this. Let's go, okay.
Speaker 2:All right, so we're going to start out with his childhood and some family background. Okay, so John Fitzgerald Kennedy was born on May 29th 1917 in Brookline, massachusetts, into a family destined for history and haunted by tragedy. His father, joseph P Kennedy Sr, was no ordinary patriarch. He was a shrewd and often ruthless businessman who made millions through stock manipulation, real estate deals and early investments in Hollywood studios. Ambitious to his core, joe Sr had one goal, and that was to build a legacy, and he did not care who or what he had to bend to do so.
Speaker 1:He was an Irishman who was not going to live in the slums man, he was ruthless.
Speaker 2:In 1938, he was appointed US ambassador to the United Kingdom, becoming the first Irish Catholic to hold this post. But his tenure ended in disgrace. He openly sympathized with Adolf Hitler, opposed American intervention into World War II and pushed for appeasement. When his views became public, fdr forced him to resign.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no shit.
Speaker 2:So JFK's mother, rose Kennedy, was a devout Catholic and a daughter of Boston Mayor John Honey Fitz Fitzgerald, which gave the family their first real political image. Rose ran the Kennedy household like a military operation. Strict schedules, religious rituals, perfect table manners, image, reputation and self-control were everything. The Kennedy home was large, large, loud and fiercely competitive.
Speaker 2:I'm sure you can tell irish nine, nine children, yeah, nine children, one throne, okay. And their father made it clear success was expected and anything less was weakness. So Jack, as John actually goes by, or was called, was physically fragile from the start, so he suffered from.
Speaker 1:Can we talk about that for a second? And I won't make it long.
Speaker 2:I don't understand, but I never understood the John Jack nickname I don't get it.
Speaker 1:It's the same syllables, same amount of letters.
Speaker 2:It's so dumb. Somebody explain it to me if there's an actual reason. Okay, so he suffered from scarlet fever, measles, whooping cough, chronic digestive issues and a debilitating thank you bad condition that would plague him for the rest of his life. Good lord he spent, I know he spent long periods in bed reading, studying, and often while his older siblings thrived. The political torch was originally meant for Joe Jr, so he was the eldest son, tall, athletic and outspoken, and Joe was just groomed to be president. But in 1944, during a top secret mission in World War II, his plane exploded midair and his body was never recovered. His plane exploded mid-air and his body was never recovered, and that single moment shifted the entire kennedy legacy and all eyes turned to jack.
Speaker 1:the sickly second son would now be forced to carry the weight of his father's ambitions and the dreams of the entire dynasty which to me was always hilarious, that he and I'm sure he backtracked on it right because they were only care about social issues, but he praised adolf hitler but then his son fought in world war ii both of his sons, yeah, I mean, like that doesn't make, I'm sure once he got flack for it, you know there's a lot that does not make sense about this family.
Speaker 2:All right, so now we kind of move on to his marriage. So in 1953, jack Kennedy married Jacqueline Bouvet, a sophisticated, well-educated socialite from a wealthy East Coast family. Jackie was 24 years old and Jack was 36.
Speaker 1:Mm, hmm.
Speaker 2:So not like the worst age gap we've ever talked about, but it's not really great If you think about I'm 36 now and a 24-year-old is like a child to me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, totally different spot in life.
Speaker 2:So, jackie, though she had studied in Paris, she spoke fluent French and had a taste for literature, art, history. She was poised, graceful and far more reserved than her husband or future husband. But Joe Kennedy Sr said she was perfect. He just loved her. She was Catholic, elegant and photogenic, a first lady in the making. From the start, their marriage was as strategic as romantic. Jfk's bachelor lifestyle was no secret and his chronic infidelity would become a defining strain in their relationship. So even before the wedding, jackie knew that Jack had trouble saying loyal, but like many women of her era, she accepted it as part of the political bargain. And as first lady, jackie redefined the role. She launched a full scale restoration of the White House, turning it into a showcase of American art and history.
Speaker 1:She actually got the Mona Lisa like sent over and like displayed.
Speaker 2:And one of the few who've gotten the Louvre to give it up. Yeah, one of the. She was the first at that time, uh. Her televised tour in 1962 reached 56 million viewers and her earned her an honorary Emmy the only first lady ever to receive one which in that time had to be most of the population, correct?
Speaker 2:uh. She became an international fashion icon and admired for her chic style, oversized sunglasses and breathy elegance. I think that's funny. So in France, president Charles famously said I do not know who is president of the United States, but I know who is the first lady so cute. But behind the glamour, their marriage was often cold and distant. Jfk's affairs, sometimes multiple at once, were an open secret among the White House staff and Washington insiders. And she endured. She just endured them in silence, often retreating to private quarters. They actually slept in separate bedrooms for much of their marriage and she traveled without him a lot, vacationing with their children, visiting her family in Europe. So she remained devoted and preserving the image of the legacy of the presidency. But they really didn't have.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it was all image.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they had four children Arabella, who was still born in 1956, caroline, born in 1957, john F Kennedy Jr was born in 1960, who later became America's prince, and Patrick, who died two days after his premature birth in 1963. So they had two kids that survived.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:Okay, so now this kind of brings us into his political career. So in 1943, during World War II, Kennedy commanded a patrol torpedo boat, the PT-109, in Solomon Islands. One night a Japanese destroyer silenced his boat in two, Silenced, Sliced his boat into. Silenced, sliced his boat into two.
Speaker 1:It was probably pretty quiet after that it was killing two crew members that were silent.
Speaker 2:So, with his back, already damaged from all his previous injuries, jfk swam miles through the Pacific, dragging a badly injured crewmate by his life, jacket strapped, clenched in his teeth. Injured crewmate by his life, jacket strapped, clenched in his teeth. And then he led the surviving crew to a remote island, signaling for help by carving a rescue message into a coconut shell. And actually that coconut is now in the Oval Office and it earned him a Navy, a Marine Corps medal and a Purple Heart. Good for him, I know so.
Speaker 1:More importantly, as you should, he well deserved. I wasn't meaning that sarcastically, no, no no for sure.
Speaker 2:So, more importantly, it build the foundation for his political image young, brave and selfless, and this kind of start was the start of the JFK legend. So after the war, with the backening of his father's wealth and political connections, he ran for Congress in 1946. He won easily, helped by Joe Sr's control of Boston's Irish Catholic voting blog and a savvy PR campaign. By 1952, he moved to the US Senate, defeating Henry, I think. Is it Cabot Lodge Jr, I don't know A prominent Republican. His campaign leaned heavily on television, newspaper ads and the kennedy charisma tools that would define his future very similar to how how obama won it was.
Speaker 2:He was one of the first ones who kind of used like the social media aspect of oh yeah, I guess you could say that social media for the day, yeah yeah, in 1960, after bravely surviving the Democratic primary season, kennedy clinched the nomination, beating out more seasoned names like Lyndon B Johnson. So he'd just be killing it. Many thought he was too young, too Catholic and too inexperienced. But what he lacked in inexperience he made up for in image control, stage presence and connections. The general election against Richard Nixon was one of the closest in US history and that was the turning point the first ever televised presidential debate. So Nixon appeared pale, sweaty and uncomfortable, recovering from illness, and he refused putting on any makeup. But Kennedy was tan and confident, looked directly into the camera, so viewers saw a leader and it was the birth of the modern political image.
Speaker 1:I feel like Nixon always liked a little bit like that though.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, jfk won the presidency by just 0.1% of the popular vote. Anyway, so at age 43, he became the youngest elected president in the us history and the first catholic to hold the office. He branded his administration for the new frontier a bold, idolistic idolistic, why do I say it? Like that era meant to inspire change, just kind of making like to your point of Obama. It's wild because he actually they said that he probably would not have won had it not been televised, because radio listeners thought that they both were very like, even keeled, and were doing a great job, because they couldn't physically see how distressed and panicked Nixon was, physically see how distressed and panicked nixon was.
Speaker 1:So it was really that televised part of the voters that watched it that were like holy shit charisma that shows through it is yeah, so, um, that was a really good point.
Speaker 2:So his inspired change pushed for civil rights through um caution, like kind of cautiously at first, promoted space exploration, famously declaring that america would send a man to the moon. He increased Cold War military aid and intelligence operations to contain communism. But his presidency wasn't anything but smooth. So in 1961, there was the Bay of Pigs invasion. So CIA backed mission to overthrow Castro in Cuba and it failed. He took the blame publicly, but privately he blamed the CIA. In 1962, the world teetered on the brink of nuclear war during the Cuban Missile Crisis. Soviet missiles were discovered in Cuba just 90 miles off the Florida coast. So for 13 tense days JFK negotiated with Nikita Khrushchev behind closed doors and the world just watched in terror. In the end he avoided war, trading a secret promise to remove US missiles from Turkey in exchange for Soviet withdrawal of Cuba.
Speaker 1:So we didn't know that, but you know, I don't care what I don't know. If it means no nukes, okay.
Speaker 2:So he was praised as a cool-headed leader. But not everybody was impressed. So the military and intelligence community saw him as too soft and some believed he was naive, others a liability. He also began escalating US involvement in Vietnam, sending thousands of advisors and greenlighting CIA missions. Though he expressed doubt previously, he never stopped the buildup. So JFK's presidency was not long, but it was packed with crisis.
Speaker 2:charm and contradiction. He inspired millions and he terrified the establishment. Okay, so that's just a little blimp on that, and now we're going to move into his health issues.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:So JFK's health issues were not just inconvenient, they were debilitating and potentially deadly. So in the late 1940s he was diagnosed with Addison's disease, a rare and life-threatening adrenal disorder. His body could no longer produce cortisol, the hormone needed to handle stress, inflammation or even regulate blood pressure. So without daily steroid treatments he could have died for something as simple as a cold or physical exertion. But Addison's wasn't his only issue. I know we already listed some of his other sicknesses as childhood. But he suffered from degenerative spinal disease, the result of a football injury and wartime trauma, and then a botched surgery for fixing it in 1954. And it actually nearly killed him Damn Yep from a post-operative infection. So to even stand or walk he had to wear a rigid back brace.
Speaker 1:There's just not enough Advil in the world.
Speaker 2:Well, he also battled chronic colitis, gastric ulcers, osteoporosis and urinary Urinary why do I keep getting an accent? Urinary tract infections, uh, some of which, according to like later reports, said that they were mostly from his sexually transmitted diseases.
Speaker 1:that he collected.
Speaker 2:That would make sense uh, he frequently, frequently ran fevers, vomited, or he was too weak to attend events, but none of this was seen by the public or any cameras.
Speaker 1:Mm-mm Image. It's the Kennedy image.
Speaker 2:To survive and to function as president. Jfk took, not Advil. He took a complex daily cocktail of medications Steroids for his Addisons, barbiturates and tranquilizers for anxiety and sleep, codeine and Dremol Demerol for pain.
Speaker 1:There we go.
Speaker 2:Amphetamines and methamphetamines for energy and alertness, testosterone, procaine and animal hormone extracts I feel like these all just cancel each other out To combat fatigue and enhance libido. And at the center of his pharmaceutical crisis was Dr Max Jacobson, which I feel like we could do an episode on him, the controversial New York physician nicknamed Dr Feelgood and his so-called vitamin shots were basically a blend of everything I kind of said so methamphetamines, steroids, painkillers, animal gland extracts. And he injected JFK regularly, including before key conferences with Khrushchev, even during foreign travel. And then some historians actually believe which it's not, I don't even know why you wouldn't believe this that he may have actually made major Cold War decisions while either high on meth or crashing down from it.
Speaker 1:I mean, listen, if I'm going to be negotiating the fate of the world and nuclear bombs, I probably would like a little meth too.
Speaker 2:Apparently, this concoction was so strong it could literally kill a horse, and at some points he was taking more than one of those shots a day.
Speaker 1:Good Lord.
Speaker 2:So White House physicians oh my God, white House physicians and secret service agents like raised alarm at Dr Feelgood and all the fucking shit he was popping. They warned that Dr Feelgood's concoctions were dangerous, addictive and unpredictable. And then one of like his regular doctors claimed jfk was wired like a spider on speed before public appearances.
Speaker 2:I don't even know what the fuck that means, but it ain't good no and yet, after all that, jfk refused to stop um and Dr Feelgood remained Kennedy's inner in his inner circle until the day of his assassination. Why? Because, like you said, the lie was bigger than the risk. The public needed to believe that he was strong, youthful and timeless. Yeah, you know so. On camera he looked tanned confident, but in reality he was holding on to a presidency by a thread stitched together with drugs denial. And it wasn't obviously until decades after his death that declassification of private medical files and the truth came out. So the image worked.
Speaker 1:At least for a while.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so now we can move on to his affairs and some scandals, because he is jam-packed for a short life man, he, he did it all, all right. So behind the polished presidential seat and perfect photo ops, jfk lived a double life one as commander-in-chief um and the other as america's most powerful womanizer, q britney spears after that's gonna be so stuck in my head now.
Speaker 1:I honestly I started with lucky stuck in my head today. Oh, that's a good one I saw a guy doing like a john mayer-esque cover of it at a raising canes and it was the best thing ever.
Speaker 2:I'd already sent you so many tiktoks I couldn't send you that one, but his affairs weren't just frequent, they were prolific, reckless and often dangerous. So I'll go through a few of them for you. So ellen romtesh uh, she was the alleged East German spy, a stunning.
Speaker 1:European.
Speaker 2:I know a stunning European socialite who frequented elite Washington parties. She was a high level actress, actress what the fuck, jesus Christ.
Speaker 1:She had high level access. Same thing pretty much.
Speaker 2:And lots of secrets, jesus, oh I guess.
Speaker 1:I guess she kind of was an actress, I guess.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they all were okay. So rumors swirled that she had been a communist plant, possibly linked to east german intelligence. Her relationship with jfk confirmed by fbi files and set off alarms at the height of the Cold War. The response she was quietly deported and the press was discouraged from reporting the story. The FBI closed the case and buried the details. Mimi L Ford, the intern. So Mimi was just 19 years old, a college sophomore, starting her White House internship when JFK seduced her in Jackie's bedroom. Perfect yeah. In her memoir, Once Upon a Secret, she described being treated like a sexual servant. She said JFK pressured her into performing oral sex on one of his aides while he watched. She traveled with him, stayed overnight at the White House and was silenced by the combination of charm and intimidation. At no point was she ever protected, only used and then erased. At one point she basically said that at the start of it she didn't feel like she was taken advantage of.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's called grooming.
Speaker 2:Exactly Because he didn't really pressure her. It was just kind of like she kept getting invited to the pool, which is weird, like why would the intern be invited to pool? And then he, he decided to take her like a tour oh, do you want a private tour of the White House? And that's when he like kind of like seduced her in the bedroom. But she's like was kind of like not OK with it, I'm not, I'm not explaining, explaining this, but like also he's the fucking president.
Speaker 2:So you're not like, you're not going to say no.
Speaker 1:It's like authoritarian bias, you know, or bias. It's awful. She was 19.
Speaker 2:Oh my God, disgusting Judith Campbell Exner, the mob mistress. So Judith wasn't just JFK's mistress, she was also the girlfriend of mom mob man. My brain is gone today you got this okay, so she was also the girlfriend of mom bought mob, not mom boss. Why do I keep saying that?
Speaker 2:you just you're girl bossing today mob boss Sam Giancana, head of the Chicago outfit. Fbi files and her later interviews claim she delivered handwritten messages between the president and the mafia, effectively acting as a liaison between the White House and organized crime. Her affair with JFK overlapped with Robert F Kennedy's Justice Department prosecuting the mafia. So the contradiction was Kennedy tried to destroy the mob while the other Kennedy was sleeping with the messenger.
Speaker 1:What could possibly go wrong? Oh God.
Speaker 2:So JFK's affairs were not isolated incidences. They were a routine part of his presidency. The Secret Service routinely ushered women into the White House through side entrances, underground tunnels and pre-cleared hotel rooms. Agents were expected to look the other way, and they often did, even when the risk was very obvious. And according to insider reports, some affairs referred to some oh my God, some. What the fuck is going on with my brain? According to insider reports, some staffers referred to the White House as a bordello, and obviously these weren't just scandals, they were breaches of national security. So a single photograph, a wiretap or a manipulated mistress could have compromised this presidency.
Speaker 1:At least hook up with them off-site.
Speaker 2:He did, he did it everywhere. Well, all off-site, he just carried on Right, convinced, his charm, his brother and power would just protect him. So there weren't just cover-ups, with just him.
Speaker 1:Convinced his, his brother, his charm would help him.
Speaker 2:No, his charm and his brother would help him oh, convince.
Speaker 1:Okay, I thought you said it backwards. I thought you said uh convince his charm, his.
Speaker 2:I don't know what my brain is doing tonight, so I very well it's all good.
Speaker 2:So some other cover ups. The Kennedys didn't want you to know. So in 1960, there was election fraud allegations. Y'all just have to deal with me, I'm so sorry. So JFK's narrow victory over Richard Nixon in the 1960 election was clouded by accusations of voter fraud. So in Illinois, particularly in Chicago, mob-controlled union bosses and ward leaders were rumored to have stuffed ballot boxes to deliver voters for Kennedy. And in Texas, lyndon B Johnson allegedly used his political machine to manipulate rural county results in JFK's favor. The mafia's involvement remains kind of be a hot topic in that as well.
Speaker 1:And Nixon allegedly knew about all this, but chose to like to not challenge the results, just to protect the stability of the country. Yeah, I mean, if you're on the brink of nuclear war, I feel like there's some things you just ignore for the time being.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so we kind of already talked about it. But Joe Kennedy Sr's shady dealings. So the Kennedy patriarch built the family fortune through bootlegging during Prohibition, alleged but not proven insider trading before the SEC existed. Questionable dealings with Hollywood studios and Nazi sympath companies, um in the 1930s and then um, as us ambassador to the uk, joe senior appraised appeasement, blamed jews for the europe's problems and said democracy is finished in england. Uh, obviously, his health, jfk's health, problems with his Addison's disease, the spinal shit, all his STDs and chronic pain were completely hidden through falsified medical records. Friendly doctors who would just lie to the press, denial of obvious symptoms, even when he would collapse at rallies or used a back brace under his suits.
Speaker 1:How did he hide the collapsing? That's impressive.
Speaker 2:They just made shit up. They literally just fucking made shit up. They also issued like deliberate misinformation to maintain the image of youth and vigor. So they just made everything up. It was crazy With all the multiple women that he had affairs with, they basically were either paid off, threatened by Bobby Kennedy, um, deported they deported Ellen, wow or mysteriously disappeared from the public eye. So the secret service and the FBI helped cover all of these affairs up. So they would smuggle the women through the back doors, like I said, destroyed all the visitor logs, they would intimidate the press. And one young woman, mary Meyer, was actually reportedly like really close to JFK JFK and dabbled in psychedelics with him, and she was actually murdered in 1964 under suspicious, suspicious, suspicious circumstances and her diary vanished.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that one's always stuck out to me as being just absolutely not right. No, it's not right.
Speaker 2:So Rosemary Kennedy tragedy. So basically JFK's sister Rosemary was born with cognitive challenges and basically what that means is that as she grew up she would just became really rebellious and she just did not really want to abide by the Kennedy structure. I guess you could say so. Joe senior had her lobotomized and not informing any of the family. He literally took her and did not tell her mother, did not tell anybody, and the operation failed catastrophically. There's too many words.
Speaker 2:Did you have a lobotomy? Yeah, I almost wore my lobotomy t-shirt. So she was actually left permanently disabled, unable to speak or care for herself, and the Kennedys hid her existence for decades, basically claiming that she was a nun or that she lived abroad. She was basically just erased from the public eye.
Speaker 1:Just absolute insanity. I think you said best at the beginning ruthless.
Speaker 2:So they were basically able to do this, although, because there is no social media, they had a tight control over their image. So they had very strategic friendships like with journalists, exclusive access to deals, like with Life magazine profiles and things like that Blacklisting or punishing reporters who asked him like too many oh my god, I didn't pick up too many questions and actually actually, like, in this era it was really taboo for even any sort of publication to even report negatively on any sort of like president or any sort of um, politician.
Speaker 1:Really, it was a different level of respect, then I think yeah you just didn't do it.
Speaker 2:So even if you, if they thought you were going to do it, they'd probably threaten you, but you just wouldn't report any of this stuff. Even after jfk's assassination, jackie crafted the camelot narrative feeding life magazine, the idea of a fairy tale presidency, and it worked. The press ran with it and it basically helped uh, pay the like, the myth over the man, like he was just great great the whole family camelot thing and obsession is.
Speaker 1:So you know that just came but that came from jackie's quote.
Speaker 2:She quoted the book or she quoted, but it's like shut the fuck up, he was dead already. Like you can't whatever yeah so. Obviously, his presidency was laced with secret operations, so plans to assassinate fidel castro included.
Speaker 1:Included poisoned cigars and exploding seashells were some of the wasn't there something with like infecting the pigs at one point too?
Speaker 2:oh yeah, there was something others there's, so much so many things.
Speaker 1:Also not before he ordered a shit ton of cigars.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah. So CIA in countries like Vietnam, congo and the Dominican Republic, secret backdoor diplomacy, diplomacy, jesus fucking Christ. Carrie, carrie I just called myself Carrie Dude. I'm telling you my brain is not right today.
Speaker 1:It's okay, we'll get you to bed after this.
Speaker 2:Holy shit.
Speaker 1:Get it out Carrie.
Speaker 2:Some believe that JFK grew disillusioned with the dark state activity and planned to dismantle parts of the CIA, which is possibly why he was eliminated. So over 3,000 classified documents related to JFK's assassination are still redacted and sealed. Presidents Clinton, bush, obama, trump and Biden have all denied, or like limited full release, citing national security. Like what is left in those files? Is it eyewitness statements, cia operation, mob links, something darker? I don't know. But basically the downfall of his presidency was, for all his charisma and idealism. Jfk's presidency was one of the high stake gambles, bruised egos and gathering enemies Behind the myth of Camelot. Jack Kennedy was making powerful people angry, and in Washington that's never without consequence. No, really quickly. Let's just go through everything that just brought this mother effer down. So the Bay of Pigs, which that was, jfk Greenlit the CSA-led operation to invade Cuba. Thank you the plan Cuban exiles would land on a remote beach, rally anti-Castro forces and spark a revelation. Instead, they were slaughtered.
Speaker 1:Revolution.
Speaker 2:What did I say?
Speaker 1:Revelation.
Speaker 2:Jesus Christ, I don't know what's wrong with my brain today.
Speaker 1:It's okay, I'll keep helping.
Speaker 2:So the Bay of Pigs invasion was a complete disaster. The CIA, I had to think did I say that right? That's what you did? Had underestimated Castro's strength and overestimated Cuba's support and basically assumed that JFK would provide US air support, which he withheld. And so 1,200 exiles were captured and the world watched America flounder.
Speaker 1:Yeah, not a good look.
Speaker 2:Nope, he did take public responsibility, like I kind of said before, but he was furious behind closed doors. He believed the CIA had set him up to fail. And then he quote, said I want to splinter the CIA into a thousand pieces and scatter it into the winds. And that quote haunted him and fueled later conspiracies of the theories of the CIA, the Cuban Missile Crisis. So basically, spy planes discovered Soviet nuclear missiles in Cuba. So JFK's military advisers pushed hard for airstrikes and a fuel invasion. But he chose diplomacy instead and risky, slow and controversial move, which that's basically where he had negotiated privately, which was highly not advised, but he did it anyway.
Speaker 1:And on meth.
Speaker 2:But he was seen as cool under pressure. But behind the scenes many in the Pentagon and CIA saw his weaknesses and basically they believed that he caved under communists.
Speaker 1:You can probably hide it from the American public, but it's a lot harder to hide it from other officials officials, uh-huh.
Speaker 2:So civil rights? Uh he was. He spoke about justice, but it was very slow to be acted on. So he feared the uh alienating uh southern democrats whose votes he, like, depended on. So for most of his presidency he avoided strong action, uh refusing a fully to fully support freedom riders and to protect Black students integrating schools. In 1963, after violent images of Birmingham and the assassination of activist I think it's Midgar Evers he finally gave national address in support of the civil rights, but it was just way too late. It couldn't be. It couldn't be proposed for less legislation, because he's a dumb, he's just a dumb. Vietnam, you know, he kind of fucked that shit up too.
Speaker 1:Nam was just a nightmare in general.
Speaker 2:He yeah. By the end of his presidency over 16000 US military personnels were stationed in Vietnam. So he basically had enemies absolutely everywhere. So he had them in Washington, cia, the FBI, the Pentagon, everywhere the mafia.
Speaker 1:It literally could be anybody his vice president like he.
Speaker 2:He just really just fucked everything up, so he has so many enemies and so many just stupid ass shit, uh, that we could literally be here for hours talking about that. So on november 22nd 1963, jfk was shot in dallas shout out to my dad's birthday, so lee har Harvey Oswald was arrested hours later, but he never stood trial, because he was shot by Jack Ruby two days later.
Speaker 1:On live television. On live TV. What a nightmare.
Speaker 2:I know so JFK was pronounced dead and you know, we all know, jackie refused to take off that blood soaked dress for hours there's pictures of it. The image of his son saluting the coffin became really iconic. Know, jackie refused to take off that blood-soaked dress for hours there's pictures of it. The image of his son like saluting the coffin became really iconic. But the warren commission concluded oswald acted alone.
Speaker 2:but most americans have never really believed that no um, but his assassination transformed into a martyr um freezing his legacy and myth and memory. But there are a lot of conspiracies around that, so we're going to touch base on them.
Speaker 1:No shit.
Speaker 2:So when the gunshots rang out in the plaza on November 22nd 1963, they didn't just end a presidency. They ignited one of the most enduring and elaborate conspiracy industries in the United States history.
Speaker 1:I mean, I feel like if you type conspiracy into Google, it kind of is like the first suggested.
Speaker 2:So who killed JFK? So the main theories are the official story. So the Warren Commission formed by President Lyndon B Johnson concluded that Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone, firing three shots from the sixth floor of the Texas school book depository. No conspiracy, no backup shooters, no inside jobs. Just few believe that after A Gallup poll shows, over 60% of Americans believe there was more to the story.
Speaker 1:Fun fact I got to stand in that window. We did our family vacation to Texas, went to the plaza and a tour of the book depository.
Speaker 2:Oh, wow. So basically people don't believe this because there's like, because the evidence like or lack thereof leaves so many questions both the evidence and lack of. There's so many weird things the breakdown is kind of number one the cia. So after the bay of pigs fiasco, um and jfk being furious about the CIA, he fired Director Alan Dules and threatened to dismantle the agency. So obviously we already read that wonderful quote. So Dules, the man that JFK removed, was later appointed to the Warren Commission overseeing the investigation into JFK's death.
Speaker 1:Oh, interesting.
Speaker 2:Many theorists yep believe that the CIA had both motive and means, control over covert operations, access to Oswald's records and a long list of enemies in Cuba, vietnam and beyond the mafia. So we already kind of talked about mob boss Sam and others that were rumored to help JFK secure key votes in Illinois and West Virginia. But after the election Bobby Kennedy as attorney general launched an aggressive crackdown on organized crime. So the betrayal enraged mob leaders who had risked exposure to back Kennedy. And Judith Exner, jfk's mistress and Sam's lover lover, allegedly passed all those messages to the men back and forth. So some theorists suggest that the mob helped plan the hit or they just kind of looked the other way the military. So JFK had grown skeptical of Cold War escalation. He signed. Oh my god, I'm like dying. My brain is so stupid. You've gotten better as you watch.
Speaker 2:OK. So he had signed and was planning to withdraw one thousand troops from Vietnam and expressed intentions to end the war entirely after reelection. Worked to cool tensions with the soviet union um singing the nuclear nope, signing the nuclear test ban treaty um and opening secret back channels with uh khrushchev. So this made him an obstacle to military military.
Speaker 1:X kerry, get it together come on, kerry this made him an obstacle to military expansion um, I'm gonna start start calling you Carrie every time you start stumbling on your words. I'm sorry, I don't like that name.
Speaker 2:So it will make me mad and I'll probably will stop stumbling. There we go. So basically, was he a peace-seeking president or just a threat to the war economy? I don't know. So maybe they killed him off, lyndon B Johnson. So those theories also swirled around that LBJ had killed him. So he was vice president. Johnson was a powerful, ruthless politician and deep ties to Texas oil defense contractors and corrupt regional figures. So some claim that LBJ resented being sidelined and feared he would be dropped from the 1964 ticket. So according to JFK's aide Kenny O'Donnell, lbj was the one who insisted JFK travel to Dallas, a city known for its political hostility and violent climate. So was that just ambition to get him there or just a coincidence? Then there's the UFOs.
Speaker 1:I mean this man literally has. He's pissed off everybody on this planet at some point, so why not the aliens?
Speaker 2:Well, it's not really the aliens, but they didn't really do it, but it's UFO disclosure, so OK, so one of the strangest ones is but I don't think it's that strange, but people think it's strange Just days before his assassination, jfk reportedly sent a memo to the CIA requesting access to all UFO intelligence files and to share that information with the Soviets as a transparency gesture.
Speaker 1:Why do all presidents always talk about disclosure and then none of them ever do it? What do they find out that makes them retract it?
Speaker 2:So the memo, sometimes called the Byrne memo, has fueled theories that JFK was on the verge of disclosing secrets that powerful interests interests didn't want revealed, which some people think this could really be a stretch. But I don't know. I I don't think it's that far of a stretch, because so much weird shit happens, like you just said, when people open up your files yeah, it gets real bizarre, real quick uh, so then there's the grassy knoll and eyewitness chaos.
Speaker 2:So multiple witnesses reported hearing shots from the grassy knoll, not just the book depository. Acoustic analysts suggest more than three shots were possibly fired in quick succession from different directions, and some witnesses were never called by the warren commission and others died under strange circumstances. So was there a second shooter?
Speaker 1:Or they just weren't found right, like the yeah it's just bizarre you might get into it, but the babushka lady who was filming it, but nobody knows what happened to her film.
Speaker 2:There. No, I can't even get into everything. This episode is already so long. There's so much with this family and him.
Speaker 1:But None of it makes any fucking sense.
Speaker 2:So then, just like even further conspiracies around the family, is that RFK was silenced. So, five years after his brother's death, robert F Kennedy was assassinated in Los Angeles during his presidential campaign. The official story a lone gunman shot him in the kitchen pantry, but forensics experts and witnesses questioned the trajectory of the bullets, and the shooter himself later claimed that he had no memory of the event. And some suggest that there's a second gunman involved, or I don't. I don't fucking.
Speaker 1:It's just crazy yeah, I mean, rfk is just as confusing it's just you, just, it's just wild.
Speaker 2:So jfk Jr, the prince who never became king. So John F Kennedy Jr was charismatic, intelligent and widely admired. The media dubbed him America's prince. But in 1999, his small plane crashed off the coast of Martha's Vineyard and the official cause was pilot error. But conditions were clear. He was uh, experienced, um, and the timing was suspicious because he was rumored to be preparing a senate run, possibly against hillary clinton. And some believe his death wasn't an accident but a primitive strike to protect the entrenched political interest. Then we move to ted kennedy. So in 1969, senator Ted Kennedy drove off a bridge, killing campaign aide Mary Jo I think it's Kopechny, that's probably wrong, but he didn't report the accident until the next morning. And then the scandal destroyed his presidential chances, and some theorists suggest that it wasn't an accident, that it was a setup to take out the last viable Kennedy Pretty much.
Speaker 2:So you know, some believe the Kennedys challenged the CIA, threatened the military industry, alienated organized crime, toyed with UFO disclosure and they just knew too fucking much. They were too dangerous, too unpredictable.
Speaker 1:To keep that kind of image, you have to make promises you can't keep. You have to make fake friendships that you're going to piss off along the way, and when you do that so many times, you build a lot of enemies. It's wild.
Speaker 2:Well, yeah, so it's like, I don't know. It's like, is it? Are they cursed by fate legacy? I don't know.
Speaker 1:So they, you, you know they were in a world of secrets, power, dark things in the shadows somebody, and I think the father honestly made a deal with the devil because they started with such lowly means. I mean, it was it. It was like a liquor store, right that? Drove them into like they started profiting off that when they shouldn't. They should have been a poor family based on irish catholic in the time and place they were so if you just shut up.
Speaker 2:uh, many believe that the family was cursed due to the patriarch joseph kennedy's alleged dealings with organized crime and moral compromises. Not necessarily the devil, but uh, even rosemary kennedy's lobotomy has been interpreted as part of a darker family effort to control image and scandal. And then obviously, to this day, documents surrounding the assassination remain classified. There's just so much which brings us to the Kennedy curse. Coincidence or curse, let's go All right. So the Kennedy family has been followed by an extraordinary string of tragedies, scandals and untimely deaths. To some people it's just misfortunes, but I believe that it is something deeper and darker. He was groomed from childhood to become the first president, but he volunteered in that top secret mission during World War II. His plane loaded with explosive detonated midair over the English Channel before he could parachute out and his death was devastated by the entire family.
Speaker 1:And it kind of shifted the whole trajectory of the Kennedys. Yeah well, had to go back to the plans real quick.
Speaker 2:So yep, kathleen Kick Kennedy. She was considered the free spirit. She was JFK's vivacious younger sister. She defined her strict Catholic upbringing by marrying Bill Cavendish, heir to the Duke of Devonshire. Billy was killed in World War II. Four years later, kick died in a plane crash in France at just 28 years old, on her way to vacation with a new love of hers that the family disapproved of, and her death was so scandalous that sudden Rose Kennedy refused to attend the funeral. I don't know. I'd be thinking that maybe dad killed her because he didn't like her second love choice.
Speaker 1:There's just way too many deaths in this one family for them to not be orchestrated to some extent.
Speaker 2:Right, oh, and that happened in 1948. So in 1963, obviously, jfk is assassinated. In 1968, the next hope, robert F Kennedy. So five years later, like we had said, bobby was assassinated, shot after declaring victory in the California primary, died in front of his wife and supporters, which is so awful. Ted Kennedy in 1969. Ted, the youngest Kennedy brother was expected to carry the torch after Bobby's death. But in 1969, after a party on, is it Chappaquiddick Island?
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, you got it right. Ted drove off a bridge, wow.
Speaker 2:Like we said, leaving Mary Jo trapped in the car and he didn't report it for 10 hours and that fucked him up. David Kennedy, the haunted son, 1984. The fourth of RFK's 11 children, david witnessed his father's assassination assassination at age 12. He never recovered emotionally struggling with.
Speaker 1:How could you?
Speaker 2:I don't know. Struggling with addiction, he died of a drug overdose in florida, in a florida florida hotel room, at 28 years old, michael kennedy. So the reckless tragedy 1997. Another of RFK's sons died at 39. While playing football in Aspen, colorado. He slammed into a tree and died instantly. At the time he was under investigation for an alleged affair with a 14-year-old babysitter, a scandal that was quickly buried under the shock of his death.
Speaker 1:Well, the easiest way to bury a scandal is to bury a Kennedy. Come on now.
Speaker 2:Right, which then brings us to, obviously, the prince 1999. So he obviously died over the vineyards in a plane crash. His body, along with his wife Caroline and sister-in-law Lauren, was recovered days later from the ocean floor. And there's obviously so many conspiracies around that Maeve, kennedy and son Gideon. So in 2020, I love the name Maeve. In 2020, the tragedy continued into a new generation. Maeve, granddaughter of RFK, went missing in April 2020 after taking a canoe out into the Chesapeake Bay with her eight-year-old son Gideon. They were caught in strong currents. After taking a canoe out into the Chesapeake Bay with her eight-year-old son Gideon, they were caught in strong currents while chasing a runaway ball. Their bodies were found days later. Another funeral I didn't know about that one and another Kennedy gone. Well, that was 2020. It wasn't even that long ago.
Speaker 1:Damn.
Speaker 2:So, over the decades, the Kennedy family endured a staggering number of public travesties Jesus Christ tragedies, breakdowns, unexplained death. Some say it's the price of legacy a family that flew too close to the sun and others whisper that it's a curse. I don't know. Whatever the truth is, the result's the same Funerals, children raised in shadows, wackadoo dynasty can we just call it karma?
Speaker 1:yeah, I mean honestly, when you you live that much of like a secret life and putting on such a front like what you say about you, know they, they had the public convinced they cared about civil rights but it was really just to further their own agenda.
Speaker 2:It has to come down to karma coming around because, like it's just bullshit. Charm was a very deeply flawed man chronically ill, heavily medicated, physically fragile, yet portrayed as the picture of health, obsessed with his image but often absent from actual governance, leaving much of the heavy lifting to his brother and advisors. He's addicted to sex power control, using the White House more as a bachelor pad.
Speaker 2:Just pick somewhere else, dude, oh my God. So basically, you know, we were surrounded by secret keeping doctors, handlers and a family determined to protect the Kennedy brand at all costs. And when he wasn't leading, he was lying to the press, to voters and sometimes to himself. And yet he remains a symbol, not because of what he did, but because of what people wanted him to be. And that's the tragedy of jfk not just a bullet in dallas, but the illusion we all agreed to believe first of all, nicely done to get through the entire kennedy history, do you?
Speaker 1:know how much assassination and the people? Oh yes, because, like I said, this is a rabbit hole. I go down all the time. Can I add one little fun fact, because I feel like I want to have you do a follow-up episode almost on just the assassination, but oh I know some of the stuff that was recently disclosed a different angle than what this is.
Speaker 1:A pruder film always showed. So you know there's a pruder film. You can see jackie kennedy instead of like kind of going to his age, she climbs out the back. They think it may have been one of the drivers. There's some new evidence came out.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I also did forget to say that, because he had to wear that brace. That's actually what killed him oh, because he couldn't like because that that first shot, because I think the first shot hit him like I don't know somewhere that wouldn't have killed him if he was not wearing that brace yeah, his body would have naturally slumped over and the second bullet would have never hit him wow, yeah he would have lived.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you have like locked mobility. Oh god, holy shit. Okay, but there's just so so much, it's so wild.
Speaker 2:But I I really just wanted to, because I I listened to a lot of different podcasts about this and there's still some people that just portray him as like so great and so collected and like, yeah, like he was a womanizer, but like you skirt past it, because the image and you know whatever, but he was actually just kind of really fucking horrible I like the way you did it, because everyone just covers the assassination.
Speaker 1:So many people don't know all of the history.
Speaker 2:That right got him to be america's golden boy so here's the thing, going back to the top of the episode, your question. It's kind of like in the beginning I think he really was going to be a great human. He saved people, he did really good and he was just a sickly child that just read his books and fantasize. I think he could have been good. But then you're put with this family that's forcing you to be this type of person. You know he used to take acting classes and he would watch actors and watch how they moved and how they stayed calm and he was so um, like I, just that's so manipulative in how he could. But he was raised that way. I don't know if he would have been that way had he not been raised and forced and his entire family was basically like oh sorry, you died. Next in line, be the president next in line.
Speaker 1:That's so fucked up and he might not have just been a womanizer. There was also a uh curious best friend that he had oh, probably, honestly I, there's so much I wouldn't even doubt.
Speaker 2:No, there's so much, fuck shit. I didn't even go through all the affairs, I didn't even go through all the women, I didn't even go really through how much jackie it's.
Speaker 1:I can't even we've been here forever, way too long. So, anyways, any of those things stuck out to you, go down the rabbit hole, cause there is. It is so interesting it really is. Wow Though, holy crap, nice job.
Speaker 2:And I thank you. I um might've left out a certain something on purpose, and that maybe might be your next episode for me. I don't know if you guys can figure it out. Put it in the comments below, whatever you're listening to.
Speaker 1:Let's do it Guess, and since she already spoiled mine, you might want to be a guest of mine as well.
Speaker 2:Guess Zach's first, and then mine.
Speaker 1:Perfect. We need to let these people go. We've been going long. What emoji do you want? Oh, oh, my god what do we do for? What do we do for this um the white house and a black?
Speaker 2:there is a white house emoji okay, there we go okay, this is a very long one. I hope I didn't repeat myself or stutter too much, and I am so sorry not before you go too fast, too right end.
Speaker 1:We want to know your theories on the assassination. Okay, now wrap it up.
Speaker 2:Or just your rabbit hole that you've dived down on him, Okay, but do all that stuff for us. The most important thing you can do for us is to creep it real. My little eyeballs.
Speaker 1:Goodbye.
Speaker 2:Bye, I'm home with the dogman. Cut the elevation, hold in the shadows. Cut the elevation and hold with the eyeballs. Hope in the shadows At the ID shop and hope with the eyeballs At the ID shop. The door's always open At the ID shop.
